[Cleanwatt]

Swapping out my old, tired Bilsteins on a 2013 Pro-4X.

New Koni's didn't have an upper shaft/seal boot protection, so I'm using the blue boot from the Bilsteins. When I put it all together, the new assembly is about 3/4" taller than the OEM set-up. Pretty **** instruction with the Koni's to be honest, tough finding any supporting documentation...

I can just maneuver it into position, but I'm having trouble getting the lower strut bolt through and mounted because the assembly is that much taller. Getting the upper three nuts on and mostly tight, I can't swing the lower mount into place with full drop on control arms... I think the Bilstein boot could be the culprit, limiting how far I can send the top cap before the nut bottoms out on all the stacked hardware beneath it if that makes sense?

Anyone have any input here? Truck's up on stands now and I'm scratching my head. First time taking on a job like this, so cut me a bit of noobie slack!

Thanks all!

 

[JVRaley]

Dunno about the Koni’s specifically, but my RC N3 struts were considerably longer than the originals they replaced, much more so than the picture you’ve got there. I didn’t have any particular trouble getting them in. Did you bust the upper ball joint loose from the spindle?

 

[Cleanwatt]

@JVRaley - I did not. Was hoping to skip that if possible considering this was meant to be an OEM equivalent swap. But I suppose that would allow extra droop of the lower Control Arm enough to get the lower bolt in, eh?

Thanks for the idea, I may give that a shot!

 

[Eurow]

Yep^^ Upper ball joint and sway bar end link coming off helps with the install.

 

[daywalker_402]

see if you can loosen the bolts on your control arms. your bushings are most likely fighting you.

 

[JVRaley]

Yep^^ Upper ball joint and sway bar end link coming off helps with the install.

Yeah, I forgot about the sway bar. Especially if you’ve only got one side in the air.

 

[Cleanwatt]

@daywalker_402 - The upper control arm is hitting the bucket where the strut mounts up top, so I think that's the limiting droop factor right now...

 

[daywalker_402]

@daywalker_402 - The upper control arm is hitting the bucket where the strut mounts up top, so I think that's the limiting droop factor right now...

disconnect your upper ball joint from the knuckle then. it will allow the LCA to drop down enough. then use a jack to push the LCA and knuckle back up high enough to get the ball joint back in.

 

[Cleanwatt]

Yeah, I forgot about the sway bar. Especially if you’ve only got one side in the air.

@JVRaley & @Eurow - sway bar is disconnected and out of the way. Have front of the truck on stands.

Could I possibly just lower that nut on the ball joint to allow more droop? I don't have any ball joint tooling.

 

[Cleanwatt]

@daywalker_402 - I think that's my plan of attack now, good idea.

Thanks @JVRaley, @Eurow, & @daywalker_402 - Gonna go give this a shot now!!

 

[daywalker_402]

@daywalker_402 - I think that's my plan of attack now, good idea.

Thanks @JVRaley, @Eurow, & @daywalker_402 - Gonna go give this a shot now!!

yep no problem! you should be able to get the ball joint out of the knuckle without a pickle fork. hammer on the knuckle beside the ball joint and it should pop loose. just make sure to not hit the threads or the boot.

 

[Eurow]

@daywalker_402 - I think that's my plan of attack now, good idea.

Thanks @JVRaley, @Eurow, & @daywalker_402 - Gonna go give this a shot now!!

When taking the ball joint off, break the nut loose and keep it on the threads while hammering. You don't want the nut completely off so the whole things doesn't go flying apart. Keeping the nut on but loose will contain the parts.

 

[RobFrisco415]

make sure to tie off the lower control arm so it doesn't strain the brake lines when it falls!

 

[Nissan4Life]

First when you put the boot on did you include the boot spacer. The stack height of all the bits between the step in the shock shaft and the last washer under the top nut is important. This is a set length that will determine drop travel and spring pre load. I suspect that you included the spacer which the Koni should not have. That is why you only have so few threads engaged on the top nut. I'd remove that spacer. If you still want to use the boot just pull out the aluminum spacer from the boot and run the boot. It will be a little sloppy but fine.

This should fix your clearance issues. The way you wrote it sounds like you needed the LCA to come up some more. But if the shock was too long you'd need the LCA to go down more right? You can always jack the LCA from the bottom if you need rise, but I don't think that is the issue. You need to compress the shock. Full extension of the shock is now going to happen after coil bucket contact. I think the Konis specify no CBC. You have changed the critical length by shimming between the "stack". There was a thread about the pros and cons of doing this recently.

 

[Nissan4Life]

yep no problem! you should be able to get the ball joint out of the knuckle without a pickle fork. hammer on the knuckle beside the ball joint and it should pop loose. just make sure to not hit the threads or the boot.

Only use pickle forks if you plan on replacing the ball joint. That is one medieval tool.
The knocking with a hammer doesn't always work. This tool works wonderfully on the upper BJ. Again I don't think this is your root problem.

Tie Rod and Pitman Arm Puller (harborfreight.com)

 

[Cleanwatt]

@Nissan4Life - You're spot with that breakdown with the stack height being the issue. The shoulder below the threaded portion on the Koni is shorter than the OEM Bilstein. I didn't think about taking the spacer out of the Bilstein boot to shorten the stack height (not sure I can without destroying it...), that might be worth a shot. I just can't imagine running the strut with the shaft and seal so exposed, especially in Vermont where the roads see a bunch of salt for half the year.

Does anyone have experience running an exposed strut like that in harsh, corrosive conditions? Salt and road grime will undoubtedly end up pooling on top of the seal around the shaft, sounds like a recipe for shortened life span.

I followed the advice from @JVRaley about loosening the upper ball joint, and was able to get another inch of droop by leaving the nut threaded sufficiently, lowering the LCA enough to get the lower mounting bolt through without hammering it in. But, I have indeed altered the droop travel and spring preload. I may take it out for a quick test drive tomorrow morning to see how it feels. Then maybe take them apart again , and try to remove that boot spacer to shorten the stack height and re-test. I'm fairly neurotic about operating equipment the way is was engineered, so I'll likely want to.

Thanks all for the quick feedback and advice. Hugely appreciated!

 

[Nissan4Life]

Did you get any pre installation measurements for height? Curious if there is any change in ride height as a result of that extra spacer. The spacer decreased preload (less height) on the spring. You can see it in your picture as the space between the coils is larger on the Koni vs the Bilstiens. But the increase in shock length gives an increase. I figure the 2 cancle each other out. But would be nice to confirm.

I ran one shock with and one without the boot for a 2 winters. The one without has some oil on the shaft, but enough to drip. The one with can have the same oil but I can not see it under the boot. So far it doesn't seem like running without is too bad. But might speed up wear a little.

 

[ssundet]

But, I have indeed altered the droop travel and spring preload. I may take it out for a quick test drive tomorrow morning to see how it feels. Then maybe take them apart again , and try to remove that boot spacer to shorten the stack height and re-test. I'm fairly neurotic about operating equipment the way is was engineered, so I'll likely want to.

Hope it works out for you. Was just reading to make sure you got them in. Taking the sway bar off, disconnecting the tie rod and upper ball joint, and tying the brake caliper out of the way to not damage the brake line is the best way to do things. Looks like you got it.

If you didn't (de)compress the spring, spring preload can't be altered. It may be different between each coilover brand, but all brands are different, the shock should also be valved slightly differently as well between Koni and Bilstein. The spring and the valving work together and determines the characteristics of each brand/coilover as a non adjustable unit. Tokico, bilstein, koni, KYB, monroe, etc all have different specifications but all fall under Original Equipment design specifications or better when new. Reliability is another factor; Koni and Bilstein excel at that and should work find for you.

I'm fairly neurotic about operating equipment the way is was engineered, so I'll likely want to.

Modifying a coilover to work not as it was intended is more of a risk, to me, if you want to run equipment as it is designed. Koni and Bilstein engineers have developed a solid reputation designing reliability into their products. I would run it as Koni and Bilstein engineers designed, but it's up to you.

OE coilovers aren't all the same length, but are close - you have a little wiggle room in overall travel, so as long as you aren't experiencing impingement (like cbc) you're fine, and you should have plenty of room before that happens.

Check out the length differences here in this coilover chart. Where do yours fit on this list among all the different length OE designed coilovers?

I hope that if you like the ride quality of the Konis, that you will feel less bothered that they aren't exactly the same dimensions as your factory bilsteins.

 

[Nissan4Life]

Hope it works out for you. Was just reading to make sure you got them in. Taking the sway bar off, disconnecting the tie rod and upper ball joint, and tying the brake caliper out of the way to not damage the brake line is the best way to do things. Looks like you got it.

If you didn't (de)compress the spring, spring preload can't be altered. It may be different between each coilover brand, but all brands are different, the shock should also be valved slightly differently as well between Koni and Bilstein. The spring and the valving work together and determines the characteristics of each brand/coilover as a non adjustable unit. Tokico, bilstein, koni, KYB, monroe, etc all have different specifications but all fall under Original Equipment design specifications or better when new. Reliability is another factor; Koni and Bilstein excel at that and should work find for you.



Modifying a coilover to work not as it was intended is more of a risk, to me, if you want to run equipment as it is designed. Koni and Bilstein engineers have developed a solid reputation designing reliability into their products. I would run it as Koni and Bilstein engineers designed, but it's up to you.

OE coilovers aren't all the same length, but are close - you have a little wiggle room in overall travel, so as long as you aren't experiencing impingement (like cbc) you're fine, and you should have plenty of room before that happens.

Check out the length differences here in this coilover chart. Where do yours fit on this list among all the different length OE designed coilovers?

View attachment 359781

I hope that if you like the ride quality of the Konis, that you will feel less bothered that they aren't exactly the same dimensions as your factory bilsteins.

Nice chart. Those 5100 really ekk out a lot of travel. Know why there are 2 difference OEM 4600s for the rear?

 

[Cleanwatt]

@ssundet - Thank you for advising. Yes, I did get them with the added spacer in with the Bilstein boot, but then quickly tore them apart to remove the boot to better accommodate as-design stack height. The haste in removing was due to CBC at full droop. Now, I'd probably never stress full droop during normal driving conditions, but it wasn't right regardless.

Two thoughts after calling Koni NA and speaking with a technical rep :
-1st being lifespan is surely compromised without a protective boot, so I ordered an OEM equivalent from an SV trim Frontier, which if I deciphered drawings correctly, attaches to a single spacer/washer below the rubber seat for the spring. So, I'm hoping this set-up can accommodate protection without adversely affecting stack height.

-2nd being the ride wasn't what I was hoping for, leading me to believe either a) I incorrectly set the rebound speed to be too fast/harsh or b) this just isn't the set-up for me...

So, either way I'm disassembling the strut assemblies again to hopefully install protective boot/bellows & going over rebound settings again in hopes of slowing/softening ride quality.

When I re-do the assembly I'll try and remember to take measurements of the Koni strut.