[OffintheDistance]

I am sure there is someone here who can shed some light on this situation as I am beyond frustrated at this point.

A couple of weekends ago my friend and I changed the spark plugs on my 05 vq40. While everything was open, we did the pcv, throttle body bypass, and cleaned the TB. My friend used a TB cleaner and rag and wiped out all of the black build up around the butterfly. My truck was running great until about 2-3 days after the job. Then the trucks starts idling high (1400 rpms) and throws a P0507 code (Idle control system - High RPM). So my friend does some research on some other forums and comes up with some threads on the same problem after cleaning the TB. He found the procedures to do the Accelerator Pedal Release Position Learning, Throttle Valve Closed Position Learning, and the Idle Air Volume Learning. The procedures turned the SES light off and lowered the Idle. Then after 3-4 days, the SES light comes back on and the truck is idling at about 1300-1500 rpms. I have gone the the reset procedures about 5 times now, each turning the light off for about 3-7 days. The 3 procedures seem to fix the idle, as well as turn off the light, but the same P0507 code comes back every time.

I cant figure what could have cause this, and everything done to the truck was mentioned above. There must be someone who has experienced the same problem after cleaning the TB, or someone who has SOME advice as to whats going on. Ive spoke to a local mechanic about this who told me to "go to the dealer, either way money will be spent." I'm a broke college student who cant afford that.
:thatswck:

 

[rcr_kx250f]

With a little research that mechanic would have found the TSB for your problem.
read this thread, 03Q45 with DTC P0507 after TB Cleaning : Q45 Forum / Cima Forum

nissan coats to TB to prevent build up. if you're in CA, and under 70K miles, it should be replaced for free. you can also have someone with Superchips, uprev, or hypertech adjust the idle.

 

[OffintheDistance]

With a little research that mechanic would have found the TSB for your problem.
read this thread, 03Q45 with DTC P0507 after TB Cleaning : Q45 Forum / Cima Forum

nissan coats to TB to prevent build up. if you're in CA, and under 70K miles, it should be replaced for free. you can also have someone with Superchips, uprev, or hypertech adjust the idle.

Thanks for the reply and link.

So with the protective coating gone (which was removed during the TB cleaning), it is now impossible for the IAVL to be relearned? Also, as it appears, Nissan only replaces TB's, so re-applying whatever was cleaned off wouldn't be an option?

"As the old expression goes; if it aint broke, dont fix it"

 

[TheOregonFront]

kids will be kids and just wont leave things alone and sometimes it comes and bites them in the a$$. this sucks man, but can i ask why did you think you needed to clean the TB so bad? was it pretty bad?

 

[bigdog]

wow, I am glad I read this. I have ordered a new air filter and when it arrives I had planned to clean the MAF and the TB.

 

[rcr_kx250f]

I don't think anyone can get the coating. Also, what's the MAF look like?

 

[bigdog]

I don't think anyone can get the coating. Also, what's the MAF look like?

check out this thread for more info on http://www.clubfrontier.org/forums/f23/maf-sensor-cleaning-41641/

 

[OffintheDistance]

I just went to Nissan and talked with a mechanic. He is certain the code and abnormal idling is a result of the TB cleaning. He said whatever was used to clean the TB most likely damaged the TPS. Nothing to do with the MAF, pcv system, or vacuum leak. I asked if he could recall the factory service manual stating not to clean the TB, he said no. He said at this point replacing the TB is a matter of whether the idle could be relearned or not.

He was also unfamiliar (never heard of) the 3 re-learn procedures including the IAVL.

 

[bigdog]

What product did you guys use?

I was planning to use CRC Throttle Body & Air-Intake Cleaner for the TB and their Mass Air Flow Sensor Cleaner for the MAF

 

[dubie2003]

What product did you guys use?

I was planning to use CRC Throttle Body & Air-Intake Cleaner for the TB and their Mass Air Flow Sensor Cleaner for the MAF

I have used that on the TB but never touched the MAF (56k or so now).

 

[TheOregonFront]

I have used that on the TB but never touched the MAF (56k or so now).

so dubie no issues with that stuff then?

 

[RedAlert]

You can use any quality throttlebody cleaner on the market. I use CRC personally. When cleaning, DO NOT MOVE THE BUTTERFLY BY HAND!. To pen it up, put the truck in drive for an auto, or first with a stick. Turn the key to On, NOT RUN. Use a depressor or have someone depress the gas pedal tothe floor. This will open the butterfly all the way up. Spray a little bit of the cleaner around the inside of the TB. I use a soft bristle toothbrush to scrub gently. Respray to remove the rest of the gunk. Wipe it out with a papertowel, just dont touch the butterfly. Release pedal and your done. It may cough and spit a little when starting up for a few seconds but that passes. In some cases the relearn may be needed, but if it's a light cleaning you should be fine. As to the OP, your TB is shot, pony up the 540 bucks for a new one and consider it a lesson learned. Take it from someone who found out the hardway

 

[cyber.shifter]

So I had a TB that was disgustingly black on the inside. I just bought this truck in October and have no idea of the maintenance habits of the previous owner. I got the proper cleaner to clean the TB and took it off so I could clean behind the butterfly (It was caked enough that the spray wasn't getting it off by itself). Got it cleaned and wiped off. Throw it back in and did the resets, and I too noticed a little bit higher idle. But now I'm getting the same code. From reading around it looks like the TB is too clean now, and that's causing the problem. I refuse to believe that cleaning something could have ruined it, so I am not going the route of replacing it. Has anyone seen this code disappear after driving it for a long while (i.e. getting some build-up in the TB)?

 

[JNR]

As long as you use TB cleaner and not Carb cleaner, you should be fine for your sensors...Sometimes it will give funny reading on you A/F mixture for a bit and *possible* to throw a code temporarily, but chances are no long term damage after you run the engine/drive for awhile...I've used TB cleaner in almost every FI vehicle I've owned with no issues, throttle cable and DBW (I do like that tip about putting it in drive and having somebody press the pedal when ign on and engine off btw) and will continue to use that along with seafoam and other combustion treatments. Nature of the beast with burning carbon based fuels is the accumulation of gunk unfortunately

As for the MAF sensor, never use TB spray on that, but rather they make special cleaners for that, although I've gotten away with rubbing alcohol on a swab, being EXTRA careful on the filaments and such...this especially works well if you get overzealous on K&N filter oil, for instance. I'm not 100% recommending the isopropyl, but just saying you can do it if you need to...best way is the specific cleaner for it that comes in an aerosol can ($$).

 

[cyber.shifter]

Unfortunately, it is a fly-by-wire TB so no cable. I wish it had a cable, then I could make adjustments. I ran through the procedures and the butterfly valve is opening and closing as it is supposed to, the idle is just off. I ran through the learning procedure about 6 times with no success. I used TB cleaner so I'm good on that, and in my truck the TB isn't anywhere near the MAF ;-).

I am of the impression that running it this way for a week will not hurt it. That is the soonest I can put it in to be looked at. I may try the learning procedure again a few times, but I'm not hopeful.

 

[rcr_kx250f]

There's 3 or 4 different re learns, depending on year, to reset the idle. Without a consult 2, it's a guessing game that they all stick. Best bet is to drive it for a while. Won't hurt anything.

 

[speed demon]

Could have had it done at a dealer for 85$ and not had to worry about it. Ahhh, backyard mechanics.

 

[JNR]

Could have had it done at a dealer for 85$ and not had to worry about it. Ahhh, backyard mechanics.

Wow, man you can't be serious? Should he also be the type that accepts a gov't handout rather than trying to look for a job?



Anyway, OP..here's a cut and paste for some reset procedures:

Nissan Frontier (2005+)

Please read all instructions and be familiar with them before any attempts.
A stop watch or an analog clock with a second's needle will be useful.

ECU Resetting Procedures

The Easy Method:

After experimenting with different timing, and reading posts by other members, I've come up with a condensed method of doing this reset. This method works EVERY time, even w/o a stopwatch. I've used this method successfully a dozen times, or so, now w/o a watch. After a few times, you won't need a watch or instructions. You'll get so darn good at it, you'll find yourself doing it while waiting at a traffic light.

Timing is not as critical with this method...no stop watch needed. Just count in your head...one-one thousand, two-one thounsand, etc, or use stop watch. The most critical step is step #3....wait 10 sec, instead of 7.

1. Ignition "ON", count to 3.
2. Depress/Release pedal 5 times...hard and fast.
3. Count to 10 (not 7!) and fully depress pedal
4. Count to 12 (SES should be blinking), release pedal
5. Count to 10, depress pedal
6. Count to 10, release pedal.
7. Turn off ignition, then start engine. Done!

Accelerator Pedal Release Position Learning
Operation Procedure

1. Make sure that the accelerator pedal is fully released.
2. Turn ignition switch ON and wait at least 2 seconds.
3. Turn ignition switch OFF wait at least 10 seconds.
4. Turn ignition switch ON and wait at least 2 seconds.
5. Turn ignition switch OFF wait at least 10 seconds.

Throttle Valve Closed Position Learning
Operation Procedures

1. Make sure that accelerator pedal is fully released.
2. Turn ignition switch is ON .
3. Turn ignition switch is OFF wait at least 10 seconds.
Make sure that the throttle valve moves during above 10 seconds by confirming the operating sound.

Idle Air Volume Learning (Throttle Position Learning)
It is better to count the time accurately with a clock.
Operation Procedures
1. Perform Accelerator Pedal Released Position Learning .
2. Perform Throttle Valve Closed Position Learning .
3. Start engine and warm it up to normal operating temperature.
4. Turn ignition switch OFF and wait at least 10 seconds.
5. Conform that accelerator pedal is fully released, turn ignition switch ON and wait 3 seconds.
6. Repeat the following (steps 7a, 7b) procedures quickly five times within 5 seconds.
7a. Fully depress the accelerator pedal (HARD)
7b. Fully release the accelerator pedal.
8. Wait 7 seconds, fully depress the accelerator pedal and keep it for approx. 20 seconds until the Check Engine Light (CEL) stops blinking and turned ON.
9. Fully release the accelerator pedal within 3 seconds after the CEL is ON.
10. Start engine and let it idle.
11. Wait 20 seconds.
12. Rev up the engine two or three times and make sure the idle speed and ignition timing are within the specifications.

 

[speed demon]

If you are getting that code it is because you haven't competed your iavl relearn. While you can do the relearn without consult 2/3, you have no way of knowing if it was completed. There are several conditions that must be met for the relearn to take (ie; engine fully warm, all loads off, etc). See tsb ntb05-067, this is a known issue with nissans. It is possible that your "friend" ruined your throttle body. Best bet is to take to the dealer and ask turn to do the iavl relearn, they usually charge an hour labor.

JNR- I am serious, now he's going to have to pay anyway. May even cost him a throttle body.
I have no idea what kind of handouts your government gives, but in my country they give EDUCATIONS, so yes.

 

[JNR]

My government comment meant that a person should try first (to better themself thru knowledge/trial and error) rather than taking the easy way out, otherwise you'll never learn. We don't know that he ruined the throttle body or anything else and if he tries the resets and drives it for awhile, I bet everything is good. Going to a dealer for something like this is a waste of money and suppose I am considered a "backyard mechanic", although since I've decided to learn how to do things and acquire tools and practice, can do anything the dealer/shop could do even better; my only limitation is some of the specialized diagnostic equipment they have access to, or similar...Something that is so simple like a TB cleaning, or oil change or anything like that is no excuse to "just go to the dealer"...Especially on a 2005 truck! There are probably 10 shops, nearby in a given vicinity, more honest and competent than the dealer on things like this. The only exception is if it's a warranty issue, as that is what you pay for in the cost of the truck and may as well take advantage.

Granted, I haven't read thru every single word in this thread, but cannot imagine a TB is ruined from a cleaner...Perhaps a sensor *maybe* if the wrong chemical was used, and that'll be his lesson....I still stand by it doesn't hurt to try and learn from this though and hopefully the damage isn't that bad, if any...