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'19 Frontier SV CC SB 4x4 Gun Metallic
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I had an unfortunate accident back in June in my 2019 Frontier.

Brief run down of what happened:
I was traveling on a four lane road in the right lane. An older lady pulled out of a parking lot on the right into the left lane up ahead of me. She was traveling slowly, but straight in the left lane. There was zero indication that she was planning to change direction, as such I proceeded on straight ahead in my lane. For some unknown reason, and completely without warning, she decided to attempt to make a right turn into a parking lot from the left lane. My Frontier was in her way.

She was at fault, ticketed on scene by the responding police officer. She even admitted fault.

Her insurance company (country financial) was in no hurry to help me at all, so I ended up filing a claim through my own insurance (Geico) to get the repairs started on my truck faster. Geico sucks. I would not recommend them to anyone at this point, and most likely I will be shopping around at my next renewal. The whole process was a nightmare. for starters, I had to fight with them just to get new OEM parts on a 2.5 yr old 19k mile truck! The adjuster has been ghosting me as far as dealing with post-repair issues. To make that situation even better, no attorneys will help, get this - because I wasn't hurt! it's a very long story that I won't go into completely here.

Fast forward.... Truck was in the shop most of the month of July. Paint and body look good, however...

The truck/suspension took a hit at 30ish mph. It was hit hard enough to bend the knuckle and damaged the hub/abs sensor, and the wheel. I drove it ~3 miles home, and after that it was apparent that It wasn't safe to drive after the accident.

They replaced the knuckle, hub, and aligned it. The post repair alignment numbers look good, and they did not have to use cam bolts to get it aligned, I knew to look for that & would not have accepted that as a repair. So it would appear the frame, or control arms and their mount brackets on the frame were not hurt.

Ever since a couple of days after getting the truck back, I've been having a very loud and obnoxious creaking/squeaking/popping noise from that side, it had been intermittent until the last week or so when it became constant with any articulation/movement of the suspension on that corner. I am pretty sure I fixed that issue this weekend - the front most body mount behind the bumper cover; the bushing was sitting in there crooked. I removed it and re-installed it/torqued it down straight as it should have been, so far zero noise after doing that... That was done yesterday. Previous to fixing that, I could push/pull at the top of the cab to rock the truck, and any movement on that front corner would cause the noise ( video/audio clip here: IMG_1614.MOV ). How likely is it that body mount bushing was the cause of that noise? I still have an open ticket at the shop to take it back for this, so I am planning to drive it a few days and see if the noise returns, and if not I probably will not take it back to them...

While I had the fender liner out to work on that body mount, I noticed there appears to be damage to the fender apron that was not repaired and simply covered up with a new fender... If that is in fact the case, I'm not happy about that... Correct me if I am wrong, but after an accident, the vehicle is supposed to be put back to the same condition as before the accident, right? SO a bent up fender apron should have been repaired/replaced, right?


SO my question is: Does anyone have any pictures of their left fender apron where the air intake goes through, that you can share here so that I can compare mine to see if mine is in fact damaged? or can anyone look at the picture below of that area and tell me if, from your experience/memory, if mine looks deformed/bent? If it was indeed left damaged, how concerned should I be about that?


I'm still pretty upset about this whole cluster ----... I bought the truck new and it is the truck I wanted, and I had no intentions of replacing it, and then this happened and now I'm stuck with it unless I want to go deep in debt to replace it, and I'm left wondering what's going to go wrong next... Lets face it, after taking a hit that hard, I could be looking at a number of premature failures of parts in that area - cv axle, diff, rack & pinion; all that otherwise would have lasted a long time... or, it could remain an awesome truck and trouble free for the remainder of its life... who knows... The uncertainty is what annoys me though, that was the whole reason I bought the truck NEW to begin with...

anyways, I think it held up remarkably well considering where and how hard she hit me, and the severity of the damage to the RAV-4 that hit me. I am amazed the air bags didn't deploy, especially the side bags.


Here's a few pictures:

Accident-
Automotive parking light Tire Car Wheel Vehicle


Wheel Tire Automotive parking light Car Vehicle




Post Repair: (yeah, the Xterra is mine too, 2010 Off-Road...)

Automotive parking light Land vehicle Car Wheel Automotive side marker light





Areas in question after repairs:

Car Automotive tire Motor vehicle Automotive design Vehicle


^ It looks like that outer layer of metal on the fender apron is deformed around where the intake tube comes through, but without something to compare it to, it's hard to know for sure. I searched online and didn't come up with any pictures to compare to.
There is also a ground connection adjacent to the air box and the ABS pump on the inside of this area that appears to me that it may have been bent slightly also, but again, it's really hard to tell.




Automotive tire Motor vehicle Tread Automotive exterior Rim


^ Body mount bushing not seated properly. I originally noticed this from a picture the shop sent me while repairs were in progress. Looking for this was the reason I pulled the fender liner yesterday. I was trying to track down the noise I have been hearing from the front end. I re-set this mount/bushing, it is now seated flat/square as it should be, and as of right now I cannot get it to make any noise at ll, so that is good... I didn't get a picture of it after re-seating it, sorry.
 
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Yes, a body mount can and will squeek like yours in the video, I have replaced a few over the years. I can;t help you with the inner fender pic, mine isn't exactly straight either after years of abuse in the bush. As for longevity concerns - that's your own level of comfort; if the frame wasn't bent amd the drivetrain was untouched, then I personally wouldn't worry about it, the body panels did what they are designed to do and crumpled to prevent structural damage.
 

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I can't enlarge the photo to get a really good look, but I don't see any signs of damage or repair to the apron - no separation of the welded seam, paint or heat damage from repairs, etc. I haven't had my fender liner off, but based on the photo of the damaged fender it doesn't look like it intruded far enough to contact the apron. It appears that the brunt of the impact was on the driver's front tire and the body damage was limited to cosmetic damage. If I saw more damage to the headlight or front bumper areas I'd suspect damage to the apron as well.

Things that would concern me based on the impact would be damage to the driver's side frame rail, primarily in the area of the control arm and strut mounts, but it sounds like the shop didn't find anything there. I would look for any fresh paint, pull marks, or heat marks in those areas just in case they did repair the frame and it wasn't noted.

If the suspension was damaged to the point that the tire and wheel were forced into the firewall that could also be damaged (the firewall is considered a structural component on "combination/unibody on frame" vehicles), but unless it was significantly damaged - or if it was repaired - it likely ins't an issue. As far as the body mount issue - it could be they messed with it during the repair (was the radiator core support damaged?), or the body simply shifted as a result of the impact (look at the other body mounts for witness marks of movement).

If you can look closer at the apron and see signs of damage, then I would be concerned. The aprons play an important role in energy absorption and can affect how well the vehicle will protect you during another collision - including the timing of the airbag deployment.

Glad you weren't injured and the appearance of your truck is to your satisfaction. As long as everything else checks out okay I'd drive that sucker until the wheels fell off. :)
 
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Take it to a well regarded shop for an inspection. They can take measurements and decide.

Clint
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks everyone.



I can't enlarge the photo to get a really good look, but I don't see any signs of damage or repair to the apron - no separation of the welded seam, paint or heat damage from repairs, etc. I haven't had my fender liner off, but based on the photo of the damaged fender it doesn't look like it intruded far enough to contact the apron. It appears that the brunt of the impact was on the driver's front tire and the body damage was limited to cosmetic damage. If I saw more damage to the headlight or front bumper areas I'd suspect damage to the apron as well.

Things that would concern me based on the impact would be damage to the driver's side frame rail, primarily in the area of the control arm and strut mounts, but it sounds like the shop didn't find anything there. I would look for any fresh paint, pull marks, or heat marks in those areas just in case they did repair the frame and it wasn't noted.

If the suspension was damaged to the point that the tire and wheel were forced into the firewall that could also be damaged (the firewall is considered a structural component on "combination/unibody on frame" vehicles), but unless it was significantly damaged - or if it was repaired - it likely ins't an issue. As far as the body mount issue - it could be they messed with it during the repair (was the radiator core support damaged?), or the body simply shifted as a result of the impact (look at the other body mounts for witness marks of movement).

If you can look closer at the apron and see signs of damage, then I would be concerned. The aprons play an important role in energy absorption and can affect how well the vehicle will protect you during another collision - including the timing of the airbag deployment.

Glad you weren't injured and the appearance of your truck is to your satisfaction. As long as everything else checks out okay I'd drive that sucker until the wheels fell off. :)

I don't know which browser you're using but you should be able to right click on the image and open in a new tab and it will give you the full size image.
The fender was pushed into the fender apron, it moved a lot more than the picture makes it look like. There is one place, in front of/below where the air intake comes through, where there was obvious visible damage, but that was so minor it didn't really concern me. What does concern me is that it looks to my eye like there is some deformation around the hole where the air intake comes through the apron (which is directly behind the major caved in area of the fender in the pictures I posted) - My concern is that any buckling/deformation/crease there could compromise its integrity in a subsequent collision, which is why I was trying to find something to compare it to.

I did look, and did not notice any evidence of any frame work. Also, the alignment is good and it drives fine. Surprisingly, it tracks as straight now as it ever did.

The wheel was not pushed backwards as far as I could tell. The radiator support was not damaged or removed/repaired as far as I know, nothing is listed on the repair order for that area, other than remove/install the grille, which had to be done to replace the bumper cover and damaged headlight.

I think the body mount simply shifted from the impact and the shop may have overlooked it. I only noticed it myself after my dad made a comment about "it could be a body mount" and I compared a picture the shop sent me after tear down to a picture I had from a previous Frontier I owned and noticed that same bushing on the other truck was sitting flat, whereas the one on my current truck was in there crooked. I only went into that after checking over the suspension a couple of times and finding nothing wrong with it to account for that noise. It was kind of a last effort before taking it back to the shop. So far, it seems to have been the culprit. fingers crossed on that one.

And yeah, I do plan to keep it.
 
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I remember this one. You got it fixed for about $3,500.
I agree it looks like some deformation around the air intake. It's pretty minor, I wouldn't worry about something like that.
Just remember, your truck was originally a roll of sheet metal that was BENT by a press to look the way it does.
 

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I don't know which browser you're using but you should be able to right click on the image and open in a new tab and it will give you the full size image.
The fender was pushed into the fender apron, it moved a lot more than the picture makes it look like. There is one place, in front of/below where the air intake comes through, where there was obvious visible damage, but that was so minor it didn't really concern me. What does concern me is that it looks to my eye like there is some deformation around the hole where the air intake comes through the apron (which is directly behind the major caved in area of the fender in the pictures I posted) - My concern is that any buckling/deformation/crease there could compromise its integrity in a subsequent collision, which is why I was trying to find something to compare it to.
Thanks - I can normally just click on the image to see the full size version but didn't have the option this time. Didn't think about opening in a new tab... :)

On the larger version I do see what appears to be two dents near the hole towards the front (left) side of the image - one looks like it came from inside the engine compartment and has some bare metal exposed and the other below it from the inner fender area. Neither of these would concern me as far as structural integrity - I would shoot some paint on the bare area though to ensure no rust/corrosion starts.

I think I see what you're referring to near the air intake - above the air inlet and forward (left) of the stamped "L"? For comparison, I just pulled my fender liner down a little and took a photo (best possible I could get by cramming my phone and hand in there;)), and it does appear that there is potentially some deformation compared to mine:

Automotive parking light Automotive lighting Hood Automotive tire Grille



That being said, based on the criteria we used when I left the auto auction, I would be hesitant to tag it as "structural damage" as it is not kinked and has not been repaired. I would, however, do - or have - a very thorough inspection done on any surrounding components to ensure there isn't damage that isn't readily visible with just a cursory check. Look at the core support - especially in the areas where it attaches to the apron - and other areas of the apron for kinks or signs of repair (if the apron or other components were "pulled" to straighten them you will generally see clamp marks, similar to what a vise would leave), heat marks if they used a torch or similar to help form the metal, etc.

If nothing else is located other than what your photo shows, I wouldn't be concerned about the structural integrity of the apron.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I remember this one. You got it fixed for about $3,500.
I agree it looks like some deformation around the air intake. It's pretty minor, I wouldn't worry about something like that.
Just remember, your truck was originally a roll of sheet metal that was BENT by a press to look the way it does.
Yeah, there was a discussion over on the Xterra forum, I just figured It would be better to come over here and get some opinions about those couple of more specific, more technical issues instead of reviving the old discussion on the other forum.

It actually ended up just under $5,000. The initial estimate didn't have the knuckle and hub on it, and I forget what else they had to do outside the original estimate. I did push for OEM parts, and they did end up using all new OEM parts on it, and I have receipts.

As far as the bends around the intake, I agree it does look pretty minimal. I just noticed it and wanted to ask about it. I know the insurance adjuster and the body shop won't give a good answer, but I figured the guys here would. So far it seems the consensus is that it doesn't look bad enough to really worry about it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I think I see what you're referring to near the air intake - above the air inlet and forward (left) of the stamped "L"? For comparison, I just pulled my fender liner down a little and took a photo (best possible I could get by cramming my phone and hand in there;)), and it does appear that there is potentially some deformation compared to mine:

View attachment 361502


That being said, based on the criteria we used when I left the auto auction, I would be hesitant to tag it as "structural damage" as it is not kinked and has not been repaired. I would, however, do - or have - a very thorough inspection done on any surrounding components to ensure there isn't damage that isn't readily visible with just a cursory check. Look at the core support - especially in the areas where it attaches to the apron - and other areas of the apron for kinks or signs of repair (if the apron or other components were "pulled" to straighten them you will generally see clamp marks, similar to what a vise would leave), heat marks if they used a torch or similar to help form the metal, etc.

If nothing else is located other than what your photo shows, I wouldn't be concerned about the structural integrity of the apron.

Thanks a bunch for going out and taking a picture to post here for me, I appreciate that!

Yes, that spot at the top was one of the spots I was looking at on mine, but also on the bottom edge below the intake hole on mine looked to possibly be pushed in a bit also, at least to my eye looking at the picture, but it could just be the light or angle of the picture since the rolled edge below that same area looks perfect. It's hard to tell for sure. There's also a slight wave to the top/top left of the intake - but, after seeing yours I see that is how that area is supposed to be. Seems the only anomaly on mine is the dent near the L, and I don't think that is enough to be worried about.

I agree about inspecting closer.

Thanks again.
 
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Thanks a bunch for going out and taking a picture to post here for me, I appreciate that!
Glad I could help - if you're like me it would bug me until I found one to compare it to!
 
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I hit a small bolder in back yard that I could not see when moving sod . luckily it only affected the lower bumper cover that joins the fenders. Both fenders were ok as well as the fogs. Can't remember if the little air dam was affected. After painting I can't tell it was damaged. But even that was close to 2K bucks at car crafters.
 

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Geico sucks. I would not recommend them to anyone at this point, and most likely I will be shopping around at my next renewal.
You shouldn't have to wait until your next renewal. You can get new insurance whenever you want and request a prorated refund from your previous carrier for any remaining days of coverage.

I bought the truck new and it is the truck I wanted, and I had no intentions of replacing it, and then this happened and now I'm stuck with it unless I want to go deep in debt to replace it
I distanced myself from having perfect vehicles after something similar happened to me with a different vehicle. Insurance will make you whole from a financial perspective. But they won't find me a 2019 PRO-4X Lux FFV; they'll just cut me a check for the fair market value of one and dust their hands.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I hit a small bolder in back yard that I could not see when moving sod . luckily it only affected the lower bumper cover that joins the fenders. Both fenders were ok as well as the fogs. Can't remember if the little air dam was affected. After painting I can't tell it was damaged. But even that was close to 2K bucks at car crafters.
Ouch, that stinks. I'm glad it sounds like the damage wasn't too bad, and you got it sorted out. It's pretty cool how a good body shop can make it look like nothing ever happened.

On a side note - you mentioned your fogs... My drivers side fog light was smashed in the accident. Both of them were hazed over internally before the accident. The shop replaced the damaged one, that was the only aftermarket part used on my truck. The new light is already hazed over inside. I really wish I would have remembered to have those looked at before the 3/36 part of my warranty expired, but it completely slipped my mind.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
You shouldn't have to wait until your next renewal. You can get new insurance whenever you want and request a prorated refund from your previous carrier for any remaining days of coverage.



I distanced myself from having perfect vehicles after something similar happened to me with a different vehicle. Insurance will make you whole from a financial perspective. But they won't find me a 2019 PRO-4X Lux FFV; they'll just cut me a check for the fair market value of one and dust their hands.
True on both points. I just didn't want to hassle with the insurance right now since it's already paid up - but I guess with this case in mind there is some inherent risk to waiting.
I guess I'll just have to weigh that and decide whether to jump now, or wait.
 

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I really wish I would have remembered to have those looked at before the 3/36 part of my warranty expired, but it completely slipped my mind.
I bought my P4X on the last day of the month 1/31/2019. It was really dead at the dealer and they really wanted to sell me a truck. I drove a hard bargain that day which one can't do anymore. Almost 3K off MSRP, made them take off doc fee, and they paid to have truck brought down from Colorado. On the financing end they really wanted to sell me a 100K mile bumper to bumper and I got them to cut that in half (about 1700 dollars) and also they said zero deductible if I brought to their dealer. Bought my BMW same year a loaded X3 and the warranty ran out on that. Not so lucky on that one, they wanted 5600 dollars to add 3 more years and the car only has 17000K miles on it. I told them I'll take a hard pass on that one lol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I bought my P4X on the last day of the month 1/31/2019. It was really dead at the dealer and they really wanted to sell me a truck. I drove a hard bargain that day which one can't do anymore. Almost 3K off MSRP, made them take off doc fee, and they paid to have truck brought down from Colorado. On the financing end they really wanted to sell me a 100K mile bumper to bumper and I got them to cut that in half (about 1700 dollars) and also they said zero deductible if I brought to their dealer. Bought my BMW same year a loaded X3 and the warranty ran out on that. Not so lucky on that one, they wanted 5600 dollars to add 3 more years and the car only has 17000K miles on it. I told them I'll take a hard pass on that one lol.
Nice. I picked mine up in October of 2019. I basically stole it considering what they are going for now! MSRP was around $34k on mine, and I got it at $28,200 out the door! You cannot get a deal like that today! Heck, it was basically unheard of when I got mine. Crew Cab v6 4x4 brand new for under $30k. It was a once in a lifetime deal I'm sure.

Back when my accident happened and I was looking at options, I drove a 2wd 3rd gen, other than it being 2wd it was equally optioned to my current truck, that truck was going to be over $40k out the door! The 4wd SV trim was mid 40's! If I wanted a Pro-4x, which was rare in this area at the time, it was going to be around $50k after markup, taxes, etc! It's absurd! There's no deals to be had right now, for sure.

I'm very fortunate to have made the decision to buy back in 2019. I've been very happy with my truck, and as long as nothing else crazy comes up from this accident I don't ever plan to get rid of it.
 

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as long as nothing else crazy comes up from this accident I don't ever plan to get rid of it.
Same with me and my Pro-4X Lux FFV. As long as it doesn't get taken from me (collision or being stolen or something similar), I hope to keep it for at least the next ten years and/or put 300,000 miles on it. I've been beyond satisfied with my SV VTP 4x4 and would gladly do the same had I not come across the Pro-4X Lux FFV.

The straw that broke the camel's back and made me crack for the Pro-4X Lux FFV are the power seats and the FF capability. Had the SV VTP 4x4 had the manually-adjustable seats from the Desert Runner/Pro-4X non-Lux, I would've not even bothered.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
The straw that broke the camel's back and made me crack for the Pro-4X Lux FFV are the power seats and the FF capability. Had the SV VTP 4x4 had the manually-adjustable seats from the Desert Runner/Pro-4X non-Lux, I would've not even bothered.
My truck is Flex Fuel also, though I have never run E85 in it. No gas stations in my current area even sell E85. I do wish it had some more adjustability on the seats, but it was not a deal breaker for me.
 

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Something not brought up here, diminished value. I don't think you will have any issues with the current state of the truck, but if you go to sell it and the buyer does a carfax or something and learns of the accident, it will diminish the value of the truck by some amount. The diminished value of the truck itself will diminish over time as the overall value of the truck goes down.

Now if your insurance company repaired your truck using your collision insurance, the are obligated to sue the other parties insurance not only for what they paid, but also for your deductible. You should also ask them to include the diminished value of your truck as of the time of the accident. I.e the trade in or private seller value just before the accident vs the trade in or private seller value to a buyer who is aware of the accident.

Based on a Pro 4x with 45k miles in excellent condition, KBB shows a diminished value of around $520. KBB does not actually give diminished values but you can estimate it by down grading the condition one grade, in your case I used Excellent vs Very Good. You would probably loose less with aa private sale vs. a dealer. Without the accident, if you traded at a dealership, they would keep the truck to resell on their used car lot. Any vehicle that has an accident history is usually wholesaled out so they would loose money on the deal.
 
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