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Calling any/all Nissan guru’s; ABS conundrum…

7K views 21 replies 9 participants last post by  smj999smj 
#1 ·
So as the title implies, I have an ABS issue, and it’s a thinker…



To start, I have no warning lights on the dash whatsoever. I have no performance issues to suggest an obvious problem that needs fixing. My problem is with the traction control system (via the ABS) activating in all sorts of situations where it shouldn’t, and hasn’t before.



If you can imagine, your going down the highway and take an exit ramp, left or right, your choice. You coast from 60ish down to 40ish and take your sweeping exit without touching the brakes or gas and all is good. Now if you were to take the exact same exit, at the exact same speed, but you touch the brakes or gas after you have started turning the steering wheel, that is when I am getting an intermittent SLIP light and I can feel the brake pedal pulsing and hear the ABS actuator under the hood. I’m not talking about a hard press on the brake pedal, or mashing the gas, I’m talking about a normal stead pressure situation. And what’s even stranger is the SLIP light won’t go away until the vehicle is moving in a nice straight line again, regardless of pedal input.



Now for what I have done to attempt to remedy the situation, and thus far failed: First I inspected all of the friction parts. I removed all of the pads and rotors, no problems. Rotors don’t have much runout at all, and pads are about 20% worn so they still have plenty of meat. The parking brake shoes had some caked on mud so I disassembled and cleaned everything. Fresh grease on the contact surfaces and a nice adjustment on the star adjusters and the parking brake is like new.

I checked all of the brake lines, and everything looks good. I did a two person bleed and the fluid wasn’t too dark, but I did get a few very tiny air bubbles from the rear drivers side. I’m suspicious that those bubbles may have been introduced at the bleeder, but either way once they came out no more air followed. In any case, I have new rear stainless lines waiting to go in since my old stainless lines are 5 years old now. I’m just waiting on the front lines to come in. And I went ahead and bought a Motive Products power bleeder and a half gallon of brake fluid so I can flush the whole system. I also ordered new hardlines for the front since they got a little rusty from grinding dust when I did the hydro bumps. All of the lines and bleeding should be done in a week, but I really doubt that will solve my problems.

I also checked all of the calipers to make sure the pistons weren’t frozen, everything moved in and out as it should. I then removed the slide pins and found that the lower slide pin on each corner had a lot of resistance to moving due to swollen rubber. The pads aren’t showing any unusual wear so I don’t think the slide pin problem is doing much right now, but in any case I ordered new lower slide pins for each caliper, those are coming in with the new hardlines next week. I also got the fancy clear 3M silicone based brake paste that Nissan uses from the factory to lube the new slide pins with. I even took the mechanical side one step further and checked the brake pedal free height, and stroke. Both measurements were spot on with factory spec, as they should be since the brake master and pedal assembly have never been touched.



So by now you are probably thinking its an electrical issue, as I was too! I had figured it was electrical anyway since it also happens when you press the accelerator, not just the brake pedal. So here’s the whopper; I replaced both rear wheel speed sensors and the problem is still there! The old sensors still look great, so I ended up putting them back in so that maybe I can sell the new sensors later. Those suckers are expensive!

I have a spares set of front sensors, both left and right that I will be swapping tomorrow, but I highly doubt that will do anything. My only other thought was that the steering angle sensor was off. I know, at this point you're probably wondering how the steering angle sensor could randomly go out of sync… Well I forgot to mention a key piece of information… The day before this issue first popped up, I installed a new head unit! I figured it would be insane that a new radio could cause such an electrical issue, but I had the battery unhooked during the install so I thought it was perfectly logical that the steering angle sensor may have done something wonky.

I parked the truck with the wheels slightly turned, and disconnected the battery for a few minutes. This would make sure that the steering angle sensor would go through its auto calibration process when next I drove the truck. I started the truck, VDC light was on steady so I knew the sensor was ready to self-calibrate. I drove in a nice straight line down the street until the light went away. I go on the freeway and it still happens! So I figure I’m running out of options at this point… I removed the new head unit and reinstalled the old one. It was a long shot but you never know with modern electronics and interference. Didn’t help one bit lol!

I did the steering angle sensor thing once more after I swapped the old head unit in and still nothing. I’ve checked all of the grounds that I can see and they’re all tight and no corrosion. I am 100% convinced its an electrical problem, and I know it will still show its ugly head after I replace all of the flex lines and bleed the system, I just know it.



My last thought worth noting was maybe all of the sudden I'm just some sort of crazy driver... I disconnected an ABS sensor so that the ABS and traction control system would deactivate and drove the same roads in the same driving style. I didn’t notice any out of the ordinary handling characteristics and no wheel spin or lock at all. Then I decided I didn’t have anything to lose at this point and drove like a daemon, it pushed hard in the corners as you would expect, and had a ton of body roll, but handled very predictable through the turns. Sure I could kick the rear end out if I really tried, but that was only under the most extreme conditions.



At this point I’m mostly out of ideas, since I’m sure it has to be electrical, but I have no steady warning lights. It's not so severe that I feel unsafe, but it sure is annoying, and should not be happening. I’ll replace the front wheel speed sensors tomorrow but I don’t expect much. You never know though, so keep your fingers crossed…



If anyone out there can think of something I missed, it’s a 2010 V6 with 42k miles on the odometer. I’ve been at this for just shy of a month now, if you can figure it out I will be eternally grateful! :bow:
 
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#2 · (Edited)
My truck does the same thing with my 33" tires and fast, tight corners. When I go back to my winter tires that are smaller, the SLIP goes away on those same corners. Annoying, yes. I just wrote it off as stupid Nissan engineers trying to 'help' spirited driving enthusiasts.

Have you considered running all your ABS sensors to one ring on your drive shaft?

 
#6 ·
My truck does the same thing with my 33" tires and fast, tight corners. When I go back to my winter tires that are smaller, the SLIP goes away on those same corners. Annoying, yes. I just wrote it off as stupid Nissan engineers trying to 'help' spirited driving enthusiasts.
I know tires can sometimes cause issues, but I've been running 33's for 5 years, and the current set of tires since March without any problems. I guess it could just be my time lol

I thought maybe it was a harmonic issue with the 255 KM2's as they have 2k miles on them now so I dropped the tire pressure to 28 (from 44) to see if that made a difference. No difference at all...

I do get a slip light if I hit cloverleafs or flyovers on the fast side since going to taller tires.

With that said, have you had the computer scanned for codes by a shop with a legit scanner? In the spring when I was having a VDC, slip and locker light flicker random issue I would scan it with my bluetooth scanner and torque app and would show no codes. When I took it to the dealer they found two or three codes. One was the steering angle code and one was for the rear locker switch.
No official scanner yet, but I have a friend with a big fancy Matco scanner. I'll get him to scan it. I'm fairly sure it has to do with the steering angle sensor.

Having a scanner to monitor the ABS system and check for ABS codes would be helpful. Also, check for play in the wheel bearings.
I checked the wheel bearings and all of the bushings and heims. Everything looks, feels, and sounds perfect... :serious:
 
#4 ·
I do get a slip light if I hit cloverleafs or flyovers on the fast side since going to taller tires.

With that said, have you had the computer scanned for codes by a shop with a legit scanner? In the spring when I was having a VDC, slip and locker light flicker random issue I would scan it with my bluetooth scanner and torque app and would show no codes. When I took it to the dealer they found two or three codes. One was the steering angle code and one was for the rear locker switch.
 
#5 ·
Having a scanner to monitor the ABS system and check for ABS codes would be helpful. Also, check for play in the wheel bearings.
 
#7 ·
I had a similar issue with my 2010 and gave up trying to figure it out which is why I now own a 2016. I still liked my 2010 better as it had a six speed.
Hoping you figure it out and not too costly.

Clint
 
#8 ·
My 2011 did the same thing after I had the Fabtech kit installed. Never did figure out what it was or how to fix it. The '14 has never had that problem unless I hit a corner fast enough to actually lose grip.
 
#9 · (Edited)
I'm determined to figure it out. It should be fixable since I didn't do anything to the truck other than remove the battery... I did have a steering angle code once that I couldn't fix with the auto calibration procedure back in 2012. I ended up taking it to the dealer and paying the $175 to have them scan and clear the code. Then I had to go through an interrogation as to why I had the battery unhooked, like I had rented the truck or something. Haven't paid the dealer to scan since.

I am 99% positive it has to do with the steering angle sensor, just because of when it decides to kick in. I found out that the ABS senors are supposed to get around 8V in and they will output a low voltage square wave as the ring rotates. I can check to see if they are all putting out a nice square wave, but if they weren't I would expect an ABS light to be on...

My friend is going to use his fancy Snap-On computer to scan it Friday, fingers crossed!
 
#10 · (Edited)
I would put my pennies on the steering angle sensor. While the truck will reset itself after a battery disconnect, I believe a legit scanner is actually needed to clear and or reset the code/sensor.

Not the same vehicle by any means, But, years ago I had a beater Dodge neon that had a bad speed sensor. Since the fix required dropping the trans, opening up the case to replace a 15 cent clip. Since it had a new clutch and the car ran "mostly fine" without that sensor reading so I just drove it. I would randomly get a CEL which I could 99% of the time clear by disconnecting the battery. BUT... that 1% time it would stay on no matter how long I left the battery disconnected. I would stop by a friend's shop with a 6 pack of beer and he would clear the code for me. He said something to the point of disconnecting the battery clears the "soft" codes, but doesn't fully clear the "hard" codes in the computer's memory as he could see time since battery disconnected, but the codes were still there. I could drive the car with no speed sensor signal since it was a Stick shift, so the car would still run fine, but the computer was indeed reading things as not right but not enough to throw it in to limp mode or turn on the CEL normally.

SO, my theory being, when you disconnect the battery, the truck is able to self adjust the steering sensor enough to drive and shut the light off, but it isn't Adjusted fully/correctly.
 
#11 ·
Yeah that's basically how it was when I had to take it to the dealer years back. Just a stored code basically. I can't believe I spaced and didn't think of a stored code before I spent all this money lol! But that's okay, I got a power brake bleeder out of it!

Right now my friend is going to scan it Friday, I'll let you guys know how it goes!
 
#12 · (Edited)
I have had this same thing happen on my X since I switched to 285's with 3000 miles on the rig. It usually takes place on paved downhills while making right turns while braking. It is a relatively common issue with Xterra's and has been discussed on TheNewX. Sorry but I cannot find the thread....

It was suggested that disconnecting the battery and touching the positive and negative terminals together would reset the ECU. I have NOT tried this and would be hesitant to do so out of fear of damage to the ECU or other components of the electrical system.

Subscribed for more info....
 
#15 ·
I have had this same thing happen on my X since I switched to 285's with 3000 miles on the rig. It usually takes place on paved downhills while making right turns while braking. It is a relatively common issue with Xterra's and has been discussed on TheNewX. Sorry but I cannot find the thread....

It was suggest that disconnecting the battery and touching the positive and negative terminals together would reset the ECU. I have NOT tried this and would be hesitant to do so out of fear of damage to the ECU or other components of the electrical system.

Subscribed for more info....
I know what they mean by touching the cables together. That always freaks people out but it's not what they think. You don't want to touch the battery terminals together, you touch the disconnected battery cables together which basically drains any capacitors. But if you leave the battery unhooked overnight any and all caps should lose their charge.

I'm just gonna call this normal for a modified vehicle. I get this often on my commute (twisty mountain roads...) ever since I switched to 285s. With 265s, I would get it rarely. It doesn't cause any harm or make me lose control so I don't worry about it. If anything its good for the system to keep flushing the abs module with new fluid every time it activates. Try and fix it if you want but to me it seems like a lot of work to a rid a minor annoyance.
But the fact that it hadn't happened for 5 years with larger tires, and 6 months with the current set tells me it's an electrical ghost that shouldn't be there. It's not so much that the problem itself bothers me, but that it is something that shouldn't be there. I know it must be fixable so I must fix it :D
 
#13 ·
I'm just gonna call this normal for a modified vehicle. I get this often on my commute (twisty mountain roads...) ever since I switched to 285s. With 265s, I would get it rarely. It doesn't cause any harm or make me lose control so I don't worry about it. If anything its good for the system to keep flushing the abs module with new fluid every time it activates. Try and fix it if you want but to me it seems like a lot of work to a rid a minor annoyance.
 
#18 ·
I've just come back to this thread to see if the scan you were going to get came up with a cause for this issue. In thinking about this some more.... it could also be caused by the change in wheel speed after going to larger tires. The differential from left to right when cornering may be tripping the slip sensors.

I agree with glamisdude that since it happens so infrequently, it isn't a huge problem but I am just curious from my engineering standpoint as to what is happening....

Any updates Nate?
 
#20 ·
I didn't have it scanned yet. For anyone who didn't know my truck was down for a few months because of a rounded brake line fitting. I cut out the flare on the brake line, replaced the fitting, but then couldn't reflare the line because they are stainless hard lines. Basically took two months for the dealer to find the replacment hard line. I still haven't put the new line in, but I ran a temporary hard line from the master down the frame to the rear passenger tire so they truck would drive. Probably next month I'll pull the bed off and drop the tank, so I can replace that stupid long line. Then I'll get it scanned.

The problem still comes up daily though. I agree that it makes sens the larger tires would trip the sensors since the difference in wheel speed wouldn't match what the computer expects at any given time. But my issue is that I've had 285's for 5 years without problem, and I had the 255's for at least 4 months before this started becoming a problem. And I had the battery out the weekend before all of this started happening. So I'm convinced it's that sensor. Once I swap lines I'll get my friend to scan it real quick and let you guys know.
 
#22 ·
There's nothing "magic" about a CONSULT scan tool. Any independent shop with a capable aftermarket scantool can read ABS codes just like the dealer. I used to use an X431 and an OTC Genysis scantool to access ABS codes on Nissans.
Larger tires won't make any difference as long as they are the same size on all of the wheels, as far as the ABS and VDC operation. The speedometer and odometer accuracy will be slightly affected, but that's all.
 
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