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seized cam bolts

18K views 28 replies 16 participants last post by  Sabretooth 
#1 ·
howdy. Hope this is the right place to post this. looking for some advice.

during spacer lift installation attempted to install cam bolts, however, I was unable to remove the stock bolts. Sprayed with PB Blaster three days in a row, and still no luck. Brought to a garage to have an alignment, they could not budge them either. charged me 30 minutes of labor anyway though. they got the toe, but can't adjust the camber, its currently to positive. Any advice on how to get these out? possible to cut them with a sawzall? what would else would I need to replace if I go that route?

Thanks in advance.
 
#3 ·
Yeah, you'll obviously need to replace them, the tough part is getting them out. If they won't even turn it makes it harder to knock them out if you cut the heads off of them. What exactly is the problem? Can you get the nuts loose and just not turn the cam bolts? Or are the nuts seized on and you can't turn anything?
 
#5 · (Edited)
Thanks all. The bolts are seized in the lca. The nuts come off, but the bolts will not budge. (Heavy salt use state.) I'll try again next week when I can get it on the lift again and will spray the pi$$ out of it. I'm not opposed to cutting them, just worried they might not come out of the arm still.
 
#12 ·
I titan swapped lol. But in all seriousness, I didnt destroy the arms and could have reused them. As for the cam bolts, I had saved my factory non adj. Bolts...so I saved the cam bolt washers and cut a groove down the center of the old bolt...slid the cam washers on an voilà! Free cam bolts...kinda.
 
#13 · (Edited)
If I could find a titan front diff. I would do that. Not many Titans in northern vermont. Junk yards here laugh at me when I call looking for anything.

Any way. I don't understand what you did? Replace the washers and leave the bolts? Can you explain? A bit more. Are the stock bolts the same as the after Market bolts?
 
#14 ·
sure no problem.

The nissan adjustable bolts use a washer that has a tooth in it, this matches up with the groove on the cam bolt. Since I couldn't save the cam bolts, I cut them between the lower arm and the mounting points. I took my time with a 4.5 inch cutoff wheel and didn't damage anything that would be more than cosmetic(hitachi, awesome for 45 bucks at lowes).

Take the factory non adjustable bolt and put in in a vice. take the cutoff wheel and cut a straight groove down the bolt just deep enough for the adjustable washer to slide on. With the washer on, you will now see the side of the bolt head to grind down to allow for full movement.





I should have ground a bit more off of the bolt head side to match the out of round of the washer, but this should explain it. Once you cut the cam bolts out it should make perfect sense. I didn't want to spend 60 bucks again for the bolts, and I didn't want to leave the truck taking up my wife's garage space, the second being more dangerous.
 
#15 ·
I got it now. thanks. wonder if the bolts being frozen would be under warranty? Not sure If I even have warranty left at this point. thanks again, I'm hopefully going to get my bolts out this weekend.
 
#16 ·
Spent 3 hours working on one bolt, no good. Bolt seized in the collar of the bushing. Cut my losses and ordered new LCA's last night. Found them for 70 each. Dealer quoted 215 each. Thieves. Lol
 
#17 · (Edited)
Ok, so I ordered new lower control arms, 120 bucks each, and set to work last night. All was going well, until i got to the steering knuckle/spindle. Guess what? another Bolt seized. i was able to remove the nut on the bolt that "grips" the ball joint stud, but the bolt itself would not come out, and therefore I could not remove the ball joint from the knuckle. I thought about cutting the bolt and/or stud, but I was afraid I'd be in trouble and not able to put it back together, and I needed to drive it the next day.

I'm sure my terminology is not accurate, but am I correct that the bolt in the knuckle that squeezes onto the ball joint stud, should just slide out? It's not threaded is it? I beat it senseless to get it out, and unfortunately rounded off the head a bit (the bolts are rather soft compared to the nuts). So I' have two options, replace the entire knuckle on both sides, or try and drill out the bolts. Any other ideas? Why on earth are all the bolts seized? I've worked on 20 year old cars, that have not even given me any trouble at all, and this car, less than 5 years old, is a PIA....
 
#18 · (Edited)
It's an interference fit since that stud is tapered. To separate that ball joint you need to leave a couple threads on that nut so it doesn't pop off and hit you or your fingers and then hit the spindle, NOT the stud on the ball joint. So you hit the knuckle part where the ball joint stud goes through with a big ball peen hammer and it will pop apart after a few good smacks.
Check out this thread for a pointer with pix on how to separate it
http://www.clubfrontier.org/forums/f26/how-prg-uca-install-pix-124937/
Let me know if that's unclear and I'll take a quick pic of what I'm talking about and post it here for you
 
#19 ·
I think maybe I'm not describing the situation well. My bad. The problem is the bottom, LCA, not the UCA. I can't get the lower control arm off from the bottom of the spindle. Another seized bolt. The spindle has a clamp built into the forged steel, bottom of it, that attaches to the LCA ball joint stud. Not a bolt, like the top of the spindle and the UCA. its a stud that is clamped. the bolt in the clamp is seized, so.. the question is--

Is that threaded? or is it smooth on the inside? The nut came off, but the bolt won't budge. It did not seem to make any difference in how tight the "clamp" was when I took the nut off, and being on the bottom , is very much exposed to the brine they spray on the roads.. which I believe is what is causing all of this.

Should I keep smacking it with a hammer? if it't threaded, that won't due any good. I have a feeling though is seized like the bolts in the bushings, which is why i was going to cut them. At this rate I'm going to replace even more parts becuase of this seize problem. Which again, I've never encountered in any other car, even my 07 Xterra was not that bad.
Ok, enough of my rant. I really appreciate the advice, and suggestions, sorry I was not so clear at first.
 
#20 ·
Oh yeah, sorry. Forgot you were working on lowers for a second. You might have to get some heat on that thing. You're replacing the arms anyway and they came with new ball joints in them right? You do NOT want to have to buy the complete spindle just to replace some cam bolts so hit it with PB Blaster or whatever you have and let it sit overnight. Then beat on it again in the am and if that doesn't work then put some heat to it if you have a torch or something. Just keep an extinguisher on hand in case the grease in the ball joint lights up. Other than that try a big ^ss breaker bar on the bolt head to see if you can break it loose and then you can cut the mushroomed end off of the bolt if it doesn't come out of the ball joint/spindle bore.
Good luck
 
#21 ·
That same bolt on one side of my truck (also less than 5 years old) was also seized like that when I did my Titan swap. Biggest PITA bolt I've dealt with yet. I had soaked it in PB Blaster already and then kept alternating between a couple minutes of heat/several good whacks with a BFH/standing on a bigass breaker bar/several seconds with the electric impact. After a few cycles like this, the impact finally jolted the bolt loose, but not before skipping across the bolt head for like 15 seconds first.

I had numerous seized bolts when I did my Titan swap. Getting them loose was ridiculously unfun.
 
#22 ·
Cam bolt removal question

I just had my truck "returned" to me because the guys at the shop did not want to risk damaging the LCA getting the cam bolts out. How exactly do they seize? Are the seized to the rubber in the bushing (hence destroying the bushings) or are there metal sleeves the bolts go thru inside the bushings? I guess what I am wondering is how the bushings get destroyed getting the bolts out?

Yes, I live in Buffalo, the land of road salt.
 
#27 · (Edited)
I just had my truck "returned" to me because the guys at the shop did not want to risk damaging the LCA getting the cam bolts out. How exactly do they seize? Are the seized to the rubber in the bushing (hence destroying the bushings) or are there metal sleeves the bolts go thru inside the bushings? I guess what I am wondering is how the bushings get destroyed getting the bolts out?

Yes, I live in Buffalo, the land of road salt.
Yes there is a metal sleeve in the bushing. Personally I've never seen any kind of bush that did not have an internal tube for the bolts. So the bolt and this tube are rusted together. The tube is exactly equal in length as the opening on Your frame that it attaches to. There is no way to get the LCA out without damaging the bush if using a cutting device. 2 years ago when I replaced the joints went for some advice to the dealer because I was walking the same path. Told me they cut it out because they have to replace the whole assy per Nissan rules. So lil Steve tried at least 5 different lubes all the fancy stuff including würth and locktite freeze and realese. And I sprayed them almost every day for weeks before I started the real work. They don’t worth ****. Nothing. Forget them. If they are about 6 years old and at 200k kms they will be seized and no air gun will even get close to move them.

I’ve got questions if You don’t mind.
Do You have proper air tools? I mean a drill and a die grinder. Also multiple sets of superior quality drill bits and/or at least a table grinder plus a cylindrical deburring tool made of steel? Also a pit or lift would be very nice altough I did it on the ground. (I assume that You have a good jack and at least a pair of quality stands cause You already started dismantling). If yes than You can start preapring for the job but it won’t be easy. And You have to be very patient and resolute. This is not a wheel change. It took about 5 hours for me to remove both LCAs and then another 3-4 to drill the reaminings out from the budhing tubes. You will be covered by layers of rasping. So gloves, glasses are a must and sweater or shirt is highly recommended. (A hat could be useful too, Your head will get covered by metal too)

As for the process. You jack up the truck then come the stands….blabla. Of course safty first You gonna spend hours under that 2 tonnes. First step: drilling. Start with smaller diameters like 4 or 5mm and try to cath the very center of the head. Drill slowly with torque! Drill till You reach at about half inch depth that will make sure You went thru the washered head. More is unnecessary we need to remove only the head now. Now You can use bigger dia bits till You can insert the grinder with deburring tool (mine was a 6mm that is strong enough not to break and only needs a 7mm hole to begin with). Here comes step to: grinding, grinding…….and on. Do it concentric. This will ensure even material removal on the entire diameter of the bore. Once You reach 13mm or up You can break off the head using Your bar. On the other side of the bolt just remove the nut and cut down the protruding leg as long as possible. Now You are able to rip out the control arm. Mount it between 2 piece of woods into the vice and go on with drilling and grinding. Again drill slowly rather with torque than speed and push it as hard as You can. Even if You do this way You've probably sharpened the TiCoXxY mega bits at least one time. At this point You can start using WD 40 or whatever is on hand and a punch+hammer combo. Remember I spent about 2 hours with this process per arm so do not expect to come out after 10 minutes. If it could get moved earlier You’ve probably would not reading this story. Naturally You can have bigger luck and get away with less work.

My observation for the spindle bolt (and in generally). If it will not turn using a 24” or bigger breaker bar then it won’t pop out with the hammer. Try to turn it first. Now You can ratchet in one hand and hammer from the other. You also damage the bolt and there are always other parts in the very near that could get hurt in the big drubbing.

Do not forget the big nut on the half shaft 36mm IIRC.

For installation I'm using copper spray for years. It won't get washed out like grease and is more heat resistant. Using on brakes and exhaust with good results.

Hope I could help and sorry for the novel.
 

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#25 ·
I live in KY which uses a significant amount of brine/salt in the winter. I took the nuts off, sprayed PB Blaster on the bolts (both ends) and let them sit overnight. A couple of taps with a hammer the next day and a brass drift pin got all four out with no problems. I did this in conjunction with a coil over replacement so the LCA was supported on a jack and was essentially "unweighted". Some minor adjustments with the jack solved what minor binding problems I encountered.
 
#26 ·
Strut removed, jack under the end of the LCA raised just enough to relieve the tension of the LCA's own weight, c-clamp the LCA to the frame, PB blast for days ahead of time, a bigass breaker bar and a BFH. If that still doesn't do the trick, you might be sawing out your LCAs.
 
#28 ·
I know this is an old thread but seeing as how I am going to do my lower arms soon has anyone tried using the balljoint press to pop out the cam bolts? Just a random thought I had pop in my head I know I am going to fight the LCAs when I do it. I say soon cause I just got a bit of clunking that started this morning, I have already done the upper balljoints.
 
#29 ·
You can try what ever you'd like just in my opinion if your replacing the arms why even bother trying you'll probably just wind up bending the tabs cut the bolt it takes a whopping 5-10min with the Diablo blades and replace it with adjustable one's this way you'll have a front end that can be aligned and the cost of the cam-bolts will be offset before you use up your set of tires
 
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